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Message #91 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed  
ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/5/07, 11:42am (Last Edited: 3/5/07, 11:15pm)
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Congratulations! If you are reading this, and you have been following along, you are now about half way done with Genesis. See, that wasn't that hard!

In this next assignment, we get a look at Abraham's son Issac, his story, and his children Jacob and Esau. Jacob wrestles with God, and he gets a new name... but this blessed man Jacob is not all-righteous... he dupes his father into giving his older brother's inhertitance to him instead.

We end right before the introduction of Joseph, of technicolor dreamcoat fame.

Deadline: March 11, 2007

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"Treat the Earth not as if it was given to you by your parents, but as if it was lent to you by your children." - Kenyan Proverb

"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw
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Message #99 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
Rob Reed  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/13/07, 10:21am
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If it is okay for everybody following the Bible Study, how about we extend the deadline for this portion to the 18th? As I am restarting the podcast and trying to do fantasy baseball related stuff (and with the new baby), I haven't gone through the new assignment.

Everybody okay with this? I'll probably post on this midweek... but, if you are not caught up, now is the time!

--------------------------------------------------------
"Treat the Earth not as if it was given to you by your parents, but as if it was lent to you by your children." - Kenyan Proverb

"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw
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Message #100 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
Larry Levy  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/13/07, 10:27am
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That's fine with me.

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" I lift up mine eyes to the hills, whence cometh my help.", Psalm 121
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Message #101 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
saundrabeach  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/14/07, 11:21am
graphic
>If it is okay for everybody following the Bible Study, how
>about we extend the deadline for this portion to the 18th? As
>I am restarting the podcast and trying to do fantasy baseball
>related stuff (and with the new baby), I haven't gone through
>the new assignment.
>
>Everybody okay with this? I'll probably post on this
>midweek... but, if you are not caught up, now is the time!


They say: "Give the project to a BUSY man, cause, HE will get it done!" That's you son, and I look forward to reading your take on God and the Bible. By the way why do people write [G-d] is this a semi-sin to actually write out the "O"?

Go Go Go Joseph, I Loved that music from "Joseph and the Technicolor Dream Coat!" Saw it twice.

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TREAT OTHERS LIKE YOU WANT TO BE TREATED WELCOME EACH NEW DAY! Just When Your Children Are Fit To Live With, They Are Living With Someone Else!
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Message #102 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
Marie Reed  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/16/07, 10:29pm
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I'm also trying to do some catch-up reading. So, this is very good for me! I'll try to get the reading done by the new due date.

I really have no excuse, except for the baby. But, I could always read to him, I suppose.

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Message #104 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
saundrabeach  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/19/07, 6:19am (Last Edited: 3/19/07, 6:22am)
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I have really been enjoying reading the Bible, I must say, and shame on me for waiting so long to do so. I love to read and do read most of the time, so why not this "classic" world renown book? Humm not sure. I certainly have read portions throughout my adult life though.

Now reading this interesting story about Issac's children first born Essau and then by seconds really, Jacob. This story presents many questions to me. Now, it says that Jacob was holding on to Essau's heel of his foot through birth. While this most likely is impossible, it continues in the second most noteable sibling rivalry since Cain and Able.

In the old testament being Hebrew was the end to beat all and they set up certain value systems that today would be poo pooed.

Such as incest and multiple wifes. (Maybe the Mormons got this interpretation)

It seemed in those days God's presence was so prevalent that you would think it would be near impossible to "get away" with anything. Seemed like one had to pray about a given situation e.g. "ask and you shall receive" kind of thing. Then it would be granted at God's timing of course.

The first position birthright was at the forefront so when Jacob managed to get Essau to give up his birthright to him, one would think that was enough. No, he with the help of his Mother, Rebeccah, who favored him, while Issac favored the oldest Essau, helped Jacob lie and cheat his father Issac, near his deathbed to obtain the "blessings" held up normally for the first born. This was not reversible, even when the truth was revealed. Why not?

Then all the wives, all the children. A man's paradise, if you ask me. This wife and then if barron, her woman servant, then God would open wombs and grant children to the formally barron as Rachel because he saw she was not loved.

God knew of China's propensity to grow. So why all the interrelationships to create people? The lineage was important, but it seemed like just "know" any and everyone and have children.

WEll after trying to get all the biblical Hebrew names straight in my mind, challenging but interesting meaningwise, I read on.

To be continued.

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TREAT OTHERS LIKE YOU WANT TO BE TREATED WELCOME EACH NEW DAY! Just When Your Children Are Fit To Live With, They Are Living With Someone Else!
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Message #105 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
Rob Reed  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/19/07, 4:15pm
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Genesis 24 starts out with an interesting method of oath. Putting the hand under the thigh. Literally, believe or not, from what I have researched on the internet, this meant putting your hands on or very near to a man's balls. Yes. Balls.

They certainly were a strange set of people in those days, weren't they? In my next arbitration/mediation/settlement negotiation, I might try this! NOT!

A justification against intermarriage is also contained... Abraham did not want his son marrying any of the Canaanites... he wanted someone from his own family. Oh, boy. Justification for incest ("go to to my father's family and to my own clan, and get a wife for my son," says Abraham in Genesis 24:38)? Incest is abound in this reading portion. Issac is betrothed to Rebekah, who is his father's great niece.

I suppose this makes them second cousins? As for Jacob and Rachel, they were actually FIRST cousins. Like Hebrew Hillbillies!

In Genesis 25, Ishmael is back in the picture as assisting in burying his father, but he gets no inheritance. A brief account of Ishmael is presented, ending with "And they lived in hosility toward all their brothers." Amazing that this holds true this very day!

Family favoritism is a repeated theme here, too. Issac favors Esau. Rebekah favors Jacob. Rachel favors Joseph as does it turns out (as we see later) so does his father Jacob/Israel.

In Genesis 25, the selling of Esau's birthright for a meal seems very strange. Esau was a great hunter. Presumably, he could've killed something and put it over a fire? But he was so famished that he couldn't wait? Weird.

Interesting parallel in Genesis 26 between Isaac and his father Abraham. They both tried to fool Abimelech by convincing the king that their beautiful wives were their sisters. Still, even though these fellas put the king at risk of beng "cursed," they were spared.

Justification for multi-marriages abound here, too... (Esau marries twice -- marries the daughter of Ishmael, in fact; Jacob marries Leah and Rachel) )as well as it being okay to cheat on your wife if you have her permission. Lots of sex with concubines (maidservants) and every woman who is not a maidservant suffers from infertility. Weird, again.

Marie and I were reading our portions together last night and chuckled over the thought that there is no mention of the women getting down with the "menservants," but what could possibly be holding them back?

Deception is also a major theme in this reading portion. Jacob "pulls the ankle" off of Esau's birthright not only by a bargain for a meal but by tricking his father into giving him the blessing/birthright. As my mom says, why couldn't Isaac just take it back and give it to Esau?

And, why does Jacob (the deceiver) become God's chosen one.

But, deception had the potential to bite Jacob/Israel in the butt when his sons do the same to the man who "defiled" their sister Dinah. This is an interesting chapter, too, as it is presumed that Dinah was raped.

But, was she?

We never hear from her! Typical patriarchal writing... was it on purpose? But, check this: the brothers say to Shechem and his father -- "But if [all the men in the town] will not agree to be circumsized, we'll take our sister and go." Genesis 34:17 -- was Dinah a hostage, or staying willingly? It looks like the latter.

What the brothers were pissed about was the premarital sex, it seems.

Genesis 32 has Jacob wrestling with God and getting renamed... but this is very strange. While this unknown wrestler cannot overtake Jacob, he can disable Jacob's hip, thereby ending the "match."

Doesn't it seem strange that God could not overtake Jacob?

These are my notes from this reading... who is caught up?

--------------------------------------------------------
"Treat the Earth not as if it was given to you by your parents, but as if it was lent to you by your children." - Kenyan Proverb

"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw
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Message #107 of 196  *NEW*
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Rob Reed
saundrabeach  
Re: ASSIGNMENT 4: GENESIS 24-36
3/19/07, 5:37pm (Last Edited: 3/19/07, 5:39pm)
graphic
>Genesis 24 starts out with an interesting method of oath.
>Putting the hand under the thigh. Literally, believe or not,
>from what I have researched on the internet, this meant
>putting your hands on or very near to a man's balls. Yes.
>Balls.


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24:2 And Abraham said unto his eldest servant of his house, that ruled over all that he had, Put, I pray thee, thy hand under my thigh: (24:2, 9)
"Put ... thy hand under my thigh."
Abraham makes his servant put his hand under his thigh while swearing to God. "Putting his hand under his thigh" is a euphemism for "holding his testicles in his hand." I guess it's sort of like swearing on the bible. But all forms of swearing are forbidden in Mt.5:34-37 and Jas.5:12.

Well this is indeed a curious method, unless man's loins were thought to be so sacred and sensitive that one had to really trust the oath taker in the permission of him addressing such a tender area.


Can you picture the oath of the President of the United States being done in this manner? Perhaps the Bible is the more PC method

>
>A justification against intermarriage is also contained...
>Abraham did not want his son marrying any of the Canaanites...
>he wanted someone from his own family.


Anita of "West Side Story" fame come to mind here singing "Stick to your own kind!" from "A Boy Like That" Remember also the custom was that a bride at time of marriage was to leave her own family and move into the home and lifes' of her husband. Perhaps being of similar culture and religion made that easier. I think the East Indian customs are that today.


>Justification for incest ("go to to my father's family and to
>my own clan, and get a wife for my son," says Abraham in
>Genesis 24:38)? Incest is abound in this reading portion.
>Issac is betrothed to Rebekah, who is his father's great
>niece.


>In Genesis 25, the selling of Esau's birthright for a meal
>seems very strange. Esau was a great hunter. Presumably, he
>could've killed something and put it over a fire? But he was
>so famished that he couldn't wait? Weird.


You will maybe already notice the shrill cries of AJ when he is hungry. He wants it now! So it better be ready. You as well as all of your brothers were raised by the Dr. Spock method with his feed on demand schedule. I doubt you would give away your birthright oh is it only a first born son? But you would get something to eat quickly ergo the "fast food calorie FAT generation" Ok blame me, I fed you when you were hungry lol


>Justification for multi-marriages abound here, too... (Esau
>marries twice -- marries the daughter of Ishmael, in fact;
>Jacob marries Leah and Rachel) )as well as it being okay to
>cheat on your wife if you have her permission. Lots of sex
>with concubines (maidservants) and every woman who is not a
>maidservant suffers from infertility. Weird, again.


I am beginning to think that multiple spouses is a good idea, especially having lots of wifes around to share the chores. Maybe that is why they invented viagra, etc.


By the way Manservants, maidservants, so God also believed slavery was permissable? Hummm... All these reversals. Maybe the South of yesterday interpreted the Bible in this manner.

>
>Deception is also a major theme in this reading portion.
>Jacob "pulls the ankle" off of Esau's birthright not only by a
>bargain for a meal but by tricking his father into giving him
>the blessing/birthright. As my mom says, why couldn't Isaac
>just take it back and give it to Esau?
>
>And, why does Jacob (the deceiver) become God's chosen one.

This makes one ponder whether God admires and condones some form of "Evil doers" (NELL quote) Maybe he perceived it to be clever and survival of the fitess. Strength in Jacob. Worrisome here.

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TREAT OTHERS LIKE YOU WANT TO BE TREATED WELCOME EACH NEW DAY! Just When Your Children Are Fit To Live With, They Are Living With Someone Else!
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