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Message #2305 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed  
Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/8/07, 2:41am
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I had not liked Barry Bonds, I found him arrogant, mean spirited and nasty.

However, regardless of all of this, one can not dispute, that if one adds up "all of the tools" to "complete" a great baseball player, his ability comprises all of these , he therefore MUST be recognised as one of the "top Five " players of all time, REGARDLESS,---

His "godfather" (Mayes), could claim the overall title of "numero uno", ---(as an uninformed "Briton" and seeing him live, Mayes gets my vote, then many point to the accomplishments of one Ted Williams, whose playing days were interrupted in his volunteering for war, W.W.2, and Korea

Again, I have not liked him,(Bonds) it is difficult to do so, given the attitude he has shown us.

Aaron was a great player, who excuded benevolence and humility, and will always be admired.

Tonight Bonds showed himself to be a "nicer guy", he was HUMBLE and gave credit to "OTHERS", his family, and finally I heard him give his Dad, the credit that "Bobby" Bonds must have deserved.

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Message #2306 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed
drrubb
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/8/07, 5:20am
I agree. Regardless of all the controversy & his sometimes arrogant cold attitude, he is one of the 5 best players of all time. He is still a first ballot hall of famer. I don't really like or dislike Bonds. My feelings towards him could best be described as indifferent, but I must say I enjoyed watching that moment last night. Pretty neat actually. We all know that Bonds probably did some sort of performing enhancing drugs, but he should not be the only one who is crucified. There are several players in baseball who are probably doing it &/or have done them. Clay Hensley, who gave up number 755 was suspended in the minor leagues for steroids. I'm not so sure that Alex Rodriguez is completely clean either. Obviously I have no proof to say that there are others in baseball doing steroids, but guess what? Barry has yet to fail a drug test either. In my mind, I think he has probably taken steroids at one time or another, but again, I have no proof. I say give the man a break. Innocent until proven guilty right? In his press conference last night after hitting 756, you heard him say plainly, clearly, & enthatically, "the record isn't tainted". Time will tell, but then again we may never truly know for sure.

All this being said though, I do feel sympathy for Hank Aaron, who we all know did it cleanly. As for basbeball, 500 HR's has apparantly become the new mark. But just as I feel for players like Hank Aaron, I also feel sympathy for guys like Fred McGriff who ended his career with 493 home runs. We all know he probably did it cleanly. He was also a class act & an ambassador to the game, but I have a strange suspiscion that he somehow won't make the hall of fame. In my eyes he is a definate hall of famer. There are guys in the hall of fame with far less home runs.

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Message #2307 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed
Rob Reed  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/8/07, 12:46pm
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I got into a debate with Chris last night... basically, I think Barry is awesome as a player, an idiot as a person... but this is an amazing feat, steroids or no steroids.

The attitude of baseball and baseball fans in general regarding this record has left me with a really bad taste in my mouth.

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"Treat the Earth not as if it was given to you by your parents, but as if it was lent to you by your children." - Kenyan Proverb

"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw
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Message #2308 of 2499  *NEW*
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Larry Levy  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/8/07, 1:10pm
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I totally agree. Bonds may be a major jerk, but there is no getting away from the fact that this is an incredible acomplishment. After all, steroids can give you more distance but they can't help your timing and it takes amazing timing to hit major league pitching.

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" I lift up mine eyes to the hills, whence cometh my help.", Psalm 121
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Message #2309 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed
Carol  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/10/07, 9:41pm
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I don't like him or dislike him, and frankly it doesn't matter... the feat is amazing and I congratulate him.

I've only been to one Giants game and I saw Barry hit two homers that night. Wow!

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The mountains are calling and I must go. ~ John Muir ~ www.tarol.com
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Message #2310 of 2499  *NEW*
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Larry Levy
Guest5740 (IP: 76.4.239.200)
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/8/07, 2:14pm
Along those lines, can we forget "OJ SIMPSON" athletic prowess!

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Message #2311 of 2499  *NEW*
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Guest5740 (IP: 76.4.239.200)
Larry Levy  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/11/07, 12:34pm
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>Along those lines, can we forget "OJ SIMPSON" athletic
>prowess!

I can't stand either guy, but to my knowledge, Barry hasn't killed anyone. I don't really get your point.

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" I lift up mine eyes to the hills, whence cometh my help.", Psalm 121
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Message #2312 of 2499  *NEW*
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Larry Levy
drrubb
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/11/07, 2:46pm
Excellent point Larry. Big difference between killing someone & possibly cheating, all be it, both are still sins. I guess the cheating is just the far lesser of 2 evils. Having said this though, even though I believe OJ did murder Nicole Brown Simpson, he still was found innocent in the court of law. If OJ didn't do it, he still probably had something to do with it.

I guess the guest's point may have been that both men, for the most part, are hated individuals. I don't like OJ at all, but to be fair, he was not found guilty. He is obviously still guilty in the court of public opinion. I believe he is guilty also, but I think it is somewhat unfair how he has been completely demonized. I will say he seems to be a low classed individual, especially after trying to make money off that recent book he wrote.

As for Barry, I'm indifferent. He hasn't failed a drug test yet. I think he has experimented with steroids at some point or another, but innocent until proven guilty I guess. Sometimes he seems to be a pretty decent guy & sometimes he appears to be an ass hole. He isn't the only one that has probably experimented with steroids in baseball though. If we are going to crucify Barry, everyone on steroids in baseball needs to take a hard fall.

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Message #2313 of 2499  *NEW*
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Larry Levy
Robert Reed  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/12/07, 5:08am (Last Edited: 8/12/07, 5:19am)
graphic
>Along those lines, can we forget "OJ SIMPSON" athletic
>prowess!
>
>I can't stand either guy, but to my knowledge, Barry hasn't
>killed anyone. I don't really get your point.

I agree,he can not be compared to the "Killer Simpson" but as I previously said, BONDS is a nasty fellow.


As I said, Bonds is one of the top 5 players of ALL time, he joins a select few., he also joins a select few of players who had a very bad reputation,of being "mean and nasty" e.g Cobb.

To be paid "millions" to perform an every day job, one which the "masses would do for free", one would think that person would never "stop smiling".

Bonds only "Scowls".

He grew up priveleged, no "sandlots", "only grass", No barefeet, as per "Dominicans", but all the "best cleats money could buy", no inner city "inner sanctums", but priveleged private schools, so "what is his problem???"

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Message #2314 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/12/07, 6:23am
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O'K, referring to my opinion as to the top five players of all time , and DEFINATELY not necessarily in order, herewith:

Bonds, Mayes, Williams, Ruth, Aaron, what say YOU???

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Message #2315 of 2499  *NEW*
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Larry Levy  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/12/07, 10:27am
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Right, Bonds is the "poster child" for steroid use in baseball. Lot's of other guys did it too and the Comish and baseball in general turned a blind eye.

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" I lift up mine eyes to the hills, whence cometh my help.", Psalm 121
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Message #2316 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed
Larry Levy  
Re: Hooray for Mr.Bonds
8/12/07, 10:28am
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Bonds has a chip on his shoulder the size of the Grand Canyon

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" I lift up mine eyes to the hills, whence cometh my help.", Psalm 121
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Message #2317 of 2499  *NEW*
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Robert Reed
Larry Levy  
Best 5 of all time
8/12/07, 10:39am
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>O'K, referring to my opinion as to the top five players of all
>time , and DEFINATELY not necessarily in order, herewith:
>
>Bonds, Mayes, Williams, Ruth, Aaron, what say YOU???

This should be a fun thread. I can't wait to hear the other guys' opinions.

There's no right or wrong answer, so here goes my list:
Ruth, Williams, Mays, Mantle, Clemente.

If this were a top 10, I'd add Gehrig, Aaron, Koufax, Gwynn and Ripken.

Honorable mentions: Reggie Jackson, Greg Maddox, A-Rod and Jeter.

Gawd, that's a lot of Yankees! Sh*t!

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" I lift up mine eyes to the hills, whence cometh my help.", Psalm 121
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